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Old April 18th, 2012, 12:45 PM   #16: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Alu View Post
Uh...this story is nothing like the Trayvon Martin one, and we are getting all the details. (it's pretty straightforward: Guy comes into store with a shotgun and tries to rob the place, guy carrying a concealed weapon (legally) uses it and stops the robbery, no loss of life anywhere to be found)

The guy who fired the shot isn't pressing any sort of charges, also, the man he shot wasn't killed.
Ah, you are referring to the links you posted. I was referring to the first post.

Yes, in that case it seems pretty open and shut.
 
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 01:23 PM   #17: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Rabid View Post
I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with carrying a weapon, or pointing a weapon at a home invader, but my problem starts with people who shoot first and ask later.
Like Han Solo, you mean?
 
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Old April 18th, 2012, 02:44 PM   #18: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Northern Lights View Post
Like Han Solo, you mean?
Exactly like Han Solo.

EDIT: Although any trained (by self, or professionally) soldier should know how to quickly identify hostile targets.

Quote Rabid edited at 02:46 PM (April 18th, 2012)
 
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which lies deeply buried from view,
consists of its attitude towards those who are at its mercy.
And in this respect mankind has suffered a fundamental debacle,
a debacle so fundamental that all others stem from it.
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 03:15 PM   #19: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Rabid View Post
I don't think there is anything inherently wrong with carrying a weapon, or pointing a weapon at a home invader, but my problem starts with people who shoot first and ask later.
There are certain situations in which you can't ask questions first though. I still think the line is clear though. No drawing because you are mad or because you don't like someone or for things like that, but when it is going to be you or them it better be you. I saw a shooting on COPS one time that clearly demonstrated this. The cops were following a loony with a knife down a highway with their guns drawn, but showed great restraint. However, at one point a cop car cut the loony off to try and stop things and a cop got caught between the car and the loony toon, and he lunged toward the cop with his knife. No time to decide "is he just pretending or joking?"
 
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 03:21 PM   #20: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Darth-gamer View Post
There are certain situations in which you can't ask questions first though. I still think the line is clear though. No drawing because you are mad or because you don't like someone or for things like that, but when it is going to be you or them it better be you. I saw a shooting on COPS one time that clearly demonstrated this. The cops were following a loony with a knife down a highway with their guns drawn, but showed great restraint. However, at one point a cop car cut the loony off to try and stop things and a cop got caught between the car and the loony toon, and he lunged toward the cop with his knife. No time to decide "is he just pretending or joking?"
Bad example, if someone is lunging toward you with a knife while you're pointing a gun at them that's a pretty big no brainer. Shoot.

I'm talking about something like the previous example of a homeowner chasing a home invader out of his house and then shooting them in the back while they're running away. Obviously his life was not in danger at that point, and instead of calling the police once they left to track them down, the guy shoots him in the back. That's just bad judgement and he deserved to be prosecuted.
 
Mankind's true moral test,
is fundamental test
which lies deeply buried from view,
consists of its attitude towards those who are at its mercy.
And in this respect mankind has suffered a fundamental debacle,
a debacle so fundamental that all others stem from it.
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 03:42 PM   #21: [Thread] [Post]
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabid View Post
Bad example, if someone is lunging toward you with a knife while you're pointing a gun at them that's a pretty big no brainer. Shoot.

I'm talking about something like the previous example of a homeowner chasing a home invader out of his house and then shooting them in the back while they're running away. Obviously his life was not in danger at that point, and instead of calling the police once they left to track them down, the guy shoots him in the back. That's just bad judgement and he deserved to be prosecuted.
But the thing is, most people know that. What is happening though, especially with the Zimmerman thing, is that this guy chased someone down, clearly not "standing his ground" and yet people are jumping all over the "Stand Your Ground laws are a license to shoot first and ask questions later" nonsense bandwangon.
 
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 04:54 PM   #22: [Thread] [Post]
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I really fail to see how he can even claim the "Stand your ground" law defense, given that he was following the guy in his car. He must have gotten out of his car at some point, and at that point I feel like Zimmerman was the aggressor. Now, I don't know all of the details of the case, but that's what I understand to be the sequence of events. I defer to the jury who decides on the case.
 
Mankind's true moral test,
is fundamental test
which lies deeply buried from view,
consists of its attitude towards those who are at its mercy.
And in this respect mankind has suffered a fundamental debacle,
a debacle so fundamental that all others stem from it.
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 08:41 PM   #23: [Thread] [Post]
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rabid View Post
I really fail to see how he can even claim the "Stand your ground" law defense, given that he was following the guy in his car. He must have gotten out of his car at some point, and at that point I feel like Zimmerman was the aggressor. Now, I don't know all of the details of the case, but that's what I understand to be the sequence of events. I defer to the jury who decides on the case.
Nobody knows all the details to the event. The only person who saw the whole thing and is still alive is Zimmerman.

That's why there isn't much the case can be compared to. I'm thinking the 2nd degree murder charges will get dropped down to manslaughter at some point, since there's no clear evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt.
 
 

 
Old April 18th, 2012, 09:06 PM   #24: [Thread] [Post]
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That's why there isn't much the case can be compared to. I'm thinking the 2nd degree murder charges will get dropped down to manslaughter at some point, since there's no clear evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt.
Depends on how much evidence the prosecution thinks it has. Nevertheless, I agree, with what is known about the case, 2nd Degree murder would probably be tough to sell to a jury, Manslaughter, however is almost a given.
 
Mankind's true moral test,
is fundamental test
which lies deeply buried from view,
consists of its attitude towards those who are at its mercy.
And in this respect mankind has suffered a fundamental debacle,
a debacle so fundamental that all others stem from it.
 

 
Old April 21st, 2012, 05:52 PM   #25: [Thread] [Post]
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Originally Posted by Darth-gamer View Post
But the thing is, most people know that. What is happening though, especially with the Zimmerman thing, is that this guy chased someone down, clearly not "standing his ground" and yet people are jumping all over the "Stand Your Ground laws are a license to shoot first and ask questions later" nonsense bandwangon.
Do I get to lol and ask if you changed your mind should be get away with it?



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